tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post3216777126853876134..comments2023-04-26T05:46:09.133-07:00Comments on Smith EWL 08-09: Fishbowl DG Chapters 17-20anneshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00573450327737964454noreply@blogger.comBlogger92125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-21132245752516182342009-03-09T15:20:00.000-07:002009-03-09T15:20:00.000-07:00katie: I think its an interesting idea to ask if e...katie: I think its an interesting idea to ask if evil wins in this book. Ultimately I think that It could be argued either way. Lord Henry in my opinion, pretty much embodies evil in this book, and he was the one that caused Dorian's death. Dorian though had also become an evil man, and because he died, it could be argued that it is a new beginning, and evil has gone away to give way to something new. Also, responding to some of Lauren's thoughts, I was conflicted for much of the book wondering if these people were homosexual or not. In the end, I dont think that they were, but I wonder why Wilde wrote the book in such a way that the male characters are so close. In our lives, their behaviors would be considered homosexual, however nowhere does it say that they are gay, and they have partners of the other sex. I have to believe though that Wilde's background did influence the relationships in the book and the characters actions toward each other.mollyp2010https://www.blogger.com/profile/03632691988960771692noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-45654722983670199492009-03-04T10:34:00.000-08:002009-03-04T10:34:00.000-08:00Lauren B: I agree with Drew, the characters are wa...Lauren B: I agree with Drew, the characters are way over the top obsessed with each other. Whether Wilde was gay or not I would still question it.KaitlanW2009https://www.blogger.com/profile/11989971544322184526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-31320263699215073372009-03-04T10:33:00.000-08:002009-03-04T10:33:00.000-08:00Sarah- Ok. So. The survivors determine who wins. I...Sarah- Ok. So. The survivors determine who wins. It doesn't matter how everyone else dies? Also, do you think that LH will start his cycle of influence again? Do you think he will plant different thoughts in someone's head? In my mind, LH is pretty much the devil, it fits, thats just what I think about him. What do you think?KatieO2010https://www.blogger.com/profile/00938909605153530527noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-12906571154607284362009-03-04T10:31:00.000-08:002009-03-04T10:31:00.000-08:00LaurenB-If Wilde was not a homosexual I still woul...LaurenB-If Wilde was not a homosexual I still would question some homosexual feelings in this book. Basil's obsession for Dorian seems to be a little over the top. I'm not saying he is gay, but I definitely question it. Also, LH and Dorian both like each other so much that I question that friendship as well.DrewB2009https://www.blogger.com/profile/03713872972216562850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-68665612555241210882009-03-04T10:30:00.000-08:002009-03-04T10:30:00.000-08:00Katie: I think it would have to be the survivor be...Katie: I think it would have to be the survivor because they can observe what happens to society post-event. SO the survivor must be the one who determines which one winsSarahE2010https://www.blogger.com/profile/12605441788876874810noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-11664500877843029872009-03-04T10:29:00.001-08:002009-03-04T10:29:00.001-08:00Sarah- but everyone doesnt die in hamlet. Hamlet's...Sarah- but everyone doesnt die in hamlet. Hamlet's friend survives. Is it the survivor who determines who the victor is? Good or evil?KatieO2010https://www.blogger.com/profile/00938909605153530527noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-86988873662879199572009-03-04T10:29:00.000-08:002009-03-04T10:29:00.000-08:00:P ;-):P ;-)Lauren Lhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07002738059738678406noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-86633111296778852472009-03-04T10:27:00.000-08:002009-03-04T10:27:00.000-08:00Kendra: Like you said it would be just weird =)Kendra: Like you said it would be just weird =)LaurenB2009https://www.blogger.com/profile/16840409608002226925noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-33601140829514187392009-03-04T10:26:00.001-08:002009-03-04T10:26:00.001-08:00Lauren: I do not think that I would have thought o...Lauren: I do not think that I would have thought of them as being gay either, but I still would have noticed their obsessions with each other, especially in the being of the book.KendraS2009https://www.blogger.com/profile/06906394076480884131noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-7199184287025744592009-03-04T10:26:00.000-08:002009-03-04T10:26:00.000-08:00Katie: well everyone doesn't die. LH is still aliv...Katie: well everyone doesn't die. LH is still alive. I think thta symbolizes evil winning, because personally I can't stand this character. But I think in this book, as in Hamlet, if all of the people die I don't think either win. I think that would mean that is just is a new beginning, a fresh start if you will.SarahE2010https://www.blogger.com/profile/12605441788876874810noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-31561290378311239932009-03-04T10:24:00.000-08:002009-03-04T10:24:00.000-08:00Kendra: I agree. If I didnt know the history behin...Kendra: I agree. If I didnt know the history behind the book I dont think I would have ever read so much into the book to noticed anything gay about it.LaurenB2009https://www.blogger.com/profile/16840409608002226925noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-88220799178774834232009-03-04T10:23:00.002-08:002009-03-04T10:23:00.002-08:00Lauren L- I think that he would blame himself for ...Lauren L- I think that he would blame himself for what happened. It is his fault that he allowed society and other people around him to influence his ideas. I think at the end of the book Dorian finally decided to take responsability and say yes this is my fault and I did this all to myself, no one did this but me. Yes, Henry was the one who was giving him influences and yes Basil was his creator, but Dorian was the one who allowed the things to happen to him and take over his life.KatieM2009https://www.blogger.com/profile/00102557760070897869noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-90169868711482904202009-03-04T10:23:00.001-08:002009-03-04T10:23:00.001-08:00Lauren B: I do not think that these characters wer...Lauren B: I do not think that these characters were gay so much as there infatuation with one another is just weird.KendraS2009https://www.blogger.com/profile/06906394076480884131noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-62491080864357721562009-03-04T10:23:00.000-08:002009-03-04T10:23:00.000-08:00Sarah/Lauren- So if everyone dies, it means evil w...Sarah/Lauren- So if everyone dies, it means evil wins? What about in Hamlet?KatieO2010https://www.blogger.com/profile/00938909605153530527noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-72153174400760586032009-03-04T10:22:00.000-08:002009-03-04T10:22:00.000-08:00Lauren-I think that good triumphed in the end. By ...Lauren-I think that good triumphed in the end. By Dorian realizing what has happened to him and destroying the picture, I think that good finally won in the end. If Dorian was never punished for how he acted or realizing how he has changed then I think evil would have won.DrewB2009https://www.blogger.com/profile/03713872972216562850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-15040040133694114212009-03-04T10:21:00.002-08:002009-03-04T10:21:00.002-08:00Lauren B: I think evil won because LH is the only ...Lauren B: I think evil won because LH is the only main character left alive. He is very manipulative and will probably "create" another Dorian Gray.<BR/><BR/>Will: I think material beauty is subjective, and inner beauty is sacred. Material beauty can be bought, but I think inner beuaty must be learned and earned.SarahE2010https://www.blogger.com/profile/12605441788876874810noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-38018347154439916982009-03-04T10:21:00.001-08:002009-03-04T10:21:00.001-08:00I believe Dorian would blame Basil because he drew...I believe Dorian would blame Basil because he drew the picture. Dorian would not be a leader or smart enough to understand that the way he is is not a single person but society in general.Lauren Lhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07002738059738678406noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-63940575275044792682009-03-04T10:21:00.000-08:002009-03-04T10:21:00.000-08:00Will: I'm not sure I would use the same words, but...Will: I'm not sure I would use the same words, but I would agree that material beauty is cheap and hollow in comparison with inner beauty, which is truly valuable. I believe the portrait is a manifestation of the material deterioration that results from Dorian's tainted inner beauty.Rick Maestashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16443020649399895031noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-78917750542179746962009-03-04T10:20:00.001-08:002009-03-04T10:20:00.001-08:00Why do we assume that there are homosexual feeling...Why do we assume that there are homosexual feeling in this book? If we didn't know about Wilde's life would we still feel like the book had gay relations in it?LaurenB2009https://www.blogger.com/profile/16840409608002226925noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-53443126665529110932009-03-04T10:20:00.000-08:002009-03-04T10:20:00.000-08:00I agree that Dorian would have in no way blamed hi...I agree that Dorian would have in no way blamed himself. It would have been anyone's fault but his.KendraS2009https://www.blogger.com/profile/06906394076480884131noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-18166792034145203682009-03-04T10:19:00.000-08:002009-03-04T10:19:00.000-08:00Lauren B: I think that evil won this battle. Two p...Lauren B: I think that evil won this battle. Two people are dead from this painting. The evil(LH) won in this epic battle of greats.EricL2009https://www.blogger.com/profile/09416691189647661242noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-37457054280656846352009-03-04T10:18:00.000-08:002009-03-04T10:18:00.000-08:00Lauren L: For some reason I feel like Dorian would...Lauren L: For some reason I feel like Dorian would blame Basil. He seemed to blame everything on Basil before he killed him, he never let LH take the blame. I don't think he would take the blame upon himself, because I don't think he realized before his death that he himself could have turned everything around. He was still selfish, and would have blamed his best friend before himself.KaitlanW2009https://www.blogger.com/profile/11989971544322184526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-65329044944763474022009-03-04T10:17:00.000-08:002009-03-04T10:17:00.000-08:00Lauren L- I dont think he would blame Lord Henry. ...Lauren L- I dont think he would blame Lord Henry. He is his mentor, Dorian was created by Lord Henry. I do not think he would blame him. Though he surely should. I think that Dorian would blame everyone but himself and LH. He is not the type of person to take the blame upon himself.KatieO2010https://www.blogger.com/profile/00938909605153530527noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-52515399106767119572009-03-04T10:16:00.006-08:002009-03-04T10:16:00.006-08:00SarahE: I think this book is a great example of go...SarahE: I think this book is a great example of good .vs. evil. The ideas of temptation, sinning, and selling one's soul define evil. Basil's character is one of the good examples who can actually see the bad in the world and stay away from it. I think that in the end, even though Dorian is destroyed, good triumphed over evil. Dorian got what was coming to him. Do you think good or evil won?LaurenB2009https://www.blogger.com/profile/16840409608002226925noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8520676540661633907.post-89633850831723672302009-03-04T10:16:00.005-08:002009-03-04T10:16:00.005-08:00*went*wentKendraS2009https://www.blogger.com/profile/06906394076480884131noreply@blogger.com