Monday, November 3, 2008

Hamlet Act 2 Fishbowl

112 comments:

TaylorH2009 said...

a

EricL2009 said...

Is Hamelt really mad or faking it like he says?

Anna P2009 said...

In Act II do you think it is smart of hamlet to act crazy with Ophelia or do you think it might come back to haunt him?

KendraS2009 said...

I think Hamlet is acting more mad than he really is but he is also really upset. He told his friends that he would start acting crazy. It is also a good cover up for him to get revenge for his father.

KatieM2009 said...

Do you think that Polonius should be spying on Laertes? Or is that crossing the line even though he is his father?

KaitlanW2009 said...

I think his acting mad is going to backfire on him at one point or another.

Lauren L said...

Hamlet is acting out because it will justify his actions in the future. His irrational behavior is foreshadowing something later in the play.

mollyp2010 said...

to eric: I think its a combanation of the two because he is mad that he is in the situation that hes in, and that his uncle did what he did. I think that he is also putting on an act though. He wants people to think that he is really angry and nuts

IreneL2010 said...

Anne: I think that it will come back to haunt him. He is out for his own gain and that always comes back in a negative way. Ophelia's feelings for him are real and she is hurting because she is not allowed to be with him. Hamlet is only making matters worse by going against that.

SarahE2010 said...

I agree wth Halley's comment that eventually Hamlet would have gone mad. In his life, there have been a lot of stressors, especially his father dying. I think he is starting to become mad just out of sheer frustration. Sometimes when people experience a big personal tragedy, they feel so many different things at once, they have no idea where to turn, or what to feel.

Wil... said...

I believe the initiation of acting crazy will ophelia will in turn make ophelia crazy and it will make it so that no one admonishes Hamlet as to controlling his actions.

KaitlanW2009 said...

What do you think it's foreshadowing?

AdrienneB2009 said...

I agree with Rick. Hamlet's behavior is planned because he can predict their response and therefore be in control of the situation because he hasn't been.

Kim C. 2010 said...

I think that Hamlet is acting in sort of a blind rage... hes not really crazy but he wants people to think he is so that he can hide his true emotions he uses Ophelia for this very reason as sort of a scape goat.

KendraS2009 said...

I think that all the father's in this book are way to suspicious of their sons and they should lay off and leave them alone.

KatieM2009 said...

I think Hamelt is going in and out of his madness. When he gets upset or thinks about everything that has happened he becomes crazy and upset about everything but when he is just living his life he can put it aside and just live his life.

Anna P2009 said...

Katie: In this book we now have 2 parents spying on their children and now a-days parents are constantly spying on their children. I believe that the controversial part is their motives for spying.

TaylorH2009 said...

what do you think of Hamlets relationship with ophelia do you think he loves her? did he ever love her?

michellem2009 said...

I think that Hamlet is just faking the fact that he is crazy, because there is no real reason for him to act insane. If he makes eveyone else think that he is crazy however, then they will not be so worried about Hamlet's plan with revealing Claudius' secret. However, it could be bad if he acts too crazy, because then his mother and uncle may take action and lock him up... or send him away... or something.

Hamlet needs to be careful.

KatieO2010 said...

I think that Hamlet acting crazy around Ophelia can only hurt people. Mainly, this would hurt Ophelia, she thinks her boyfriend is crazy because of her, this will lead to some strong emotions on both of their parts.

annes said...

Outer circle- do not forget that part of your job is to come into the inner circle'sconversation. Use those legs and your brain.

AdrienneB2009 said...

In every situation that Hamlet gets the desired response, he becomes more of a puppet master.

KendraS2009 said...

I agree with Michelle. Hamlet can be upset over the death of his father and his mother and uncle, but that is not going to make him crazy.

Kim C. 2010 said...

Goin towards the middle discussion: what is the meaning of the play? What is the play going to show claudis to reveal his true colors?

AdrienneB2009 said...

Katie: is HAmlet using Ophelia as a pon or does he really love her?

KatieM2009 said...

Taylor: Yes I think Hamlet really has feelings for Ophelia but I think he thinks about himself first when it comes to the emotions of their relationship. He may be going crazy but I believe his feelings for Ophelia are real.

SaraB2009 said...

Taylor: I think Hamlet loved her, I don't think that in a time of such grief he would be pretending to love her. Also if they are not suppose to be together and he wants to see her, that is sort of risky to do.

KatieO2010 said...

Taylor: I don't think that Hamlet really loves her, as we have said, this is a play of selfishness. Selfishness and love for others doesn't really go together. Hamlet may think he loves her but he really cant.

KaitlanW2009 said...

Kim: I think the play is going to almost replay the murder for Claudius, causing him to be so uncomfortable that his concious steps in, and he may confess.

mollyp2010 said...

As Rick mentioned, I think that Hamlet is quite clever....although, the people around him are smart too-they may start to see through him. What do you guys think?

Kim C. 2010 said...

so then adrienne: Does Hamlet pull the strings of every person, doesnt this contradict tragic hero qualities where they have no control over destiny and fate?

Anna P2009 said...

Katie: It could be both. Hamlet could have true feelings for Ophelia but he could still use her. It isn't good or right but it is possible.

michellem2009 said...

Kim: I think that the play is going to be used to try and lure Claudius into telling the truth of King Hamlet's death, or at least showing some inclination of guilt from the murder. Hamlet is tricking Claudius without Claudius knowing.

SarahE2010 said...

Kaitlin: i think Hamlet's acts are foreshadowing more tragedies for him. If he keeps acting out with Ophelia, she will probably leave him, which will cause him to go more insane.

TaylorS2009 said...

I think Hamlet is both acting crazy and is because he is so torn apart with his emotions and as it was mentioned in the inner circle, it's to have people be used to him making irrational decisions so he won't be as condemned for killing Claudius

Wil... said...

are Hamlet's actions forcing him to destroy relationships, and become an arrogant fool like his Uncle?

IreneL2010 said...

Kim: I think that Hamlet is playing "puppet master". He is using his royal power to his favor...but if we are talking about a hero's quality, he is trying to create his own fate, but he is blind to that fact that by doing so he is destroying himself.

KendraS2009 said...

I think that Hamlet really loves Ophelia. The fact that he can't be with her does not make him love her less but it only adds to his grief more.

KatieM2009 said...

I think this play has many different meanings. Overall this play seems to be very corrupt and shows many scenes of betrayal. With the fathers being suspicious of their sons, Polonius betraying Ophelia by not allowing her to be with Hamlet when she is in love with him. Also, betrayal is shown through out the family with the killing of King Hamlet and Claudius taking reign of the family. Does anyone else see other ways of betrayl in the story?

Kim C. 2010 said...

michelle: So how is Hamlet going to make Claudis react to this when he in fact is very cold-blooded and had really no problem killing his brother in the first place?

AdrienneB2009 said...

Is there anything good in this play? The idea of standing up for what is right and bringing down a lying villain is a noble cause. However, it turns bad when Hamlet relaizes the conflict...kill his uncle, avenge his father, lose the crown, go to hell.

KaitlanW2009 said...

Kim: in my opinion Claudius did have trouble killing his brother but his lust for his sister in law was greater than his doubts about killing his brother. I also think if it is brought up subtly in front of everyone it will be harder to deal with because he will feel like everyone knows.

Kim C. 2010 said...

What are the parallels between Laerates and Hamlet? Are these parallels the building blocks of a second tragic hero?

AdrienneB2009 said...

Is Shakespear condemning lyers and selfish people for their acts? All that awaits them is a downfall? Does anyone know of his own experiences?

KendraS2009 said...

Irene: I don't think Hamlet is trying to control his fate, so much as he is just going after everything he wants. Just because he is going about it in a weird way does not mean he is trying to control his own fate.

TaylorH2009 said...

Is hamlets inability to take action on his uncle his tragic flaw?

KatieO2010 said...

Adrienne: I think there is alot of good in this play,at least at the root. Polonious spies on his son, but he is trying to make sure he's behaving, which is a noble intention. Hamlet wants to expose his Uncle, which is a good thing, but he may not be going about it in the right way. At the base of all the character's actions, is good, but the good is twisted into evil.

RickM2009 said...

adrienne: But does it matter to Hamlet that no matter what he is doomed, or is it more important to him that what he views as good is what transpires?

TaylorS2009 said...

Adrienne: I don't think there is anything good in this play at all. Shakespere wanted to tell the world that everyone in the world is bad, corrupt and there is no way to justify anything, such as vengence.

KaitlanW2009 said...

I don't think there is any good in this play Adrienne, it's so dark and evil this early in the plot. I don't think there's any going back, even if things get better, the incest, and murder will never go away.

KatieO2010 said...

Taylor: I don't think his hesitation in exposing his uncle is a tragic flaw, its only human. This is a big step he is taking. I think it would be more of a flaw if he acted immediately and did not think through his actions.

AdrienneB2009 said...

Kaitlin: Wasn't Clauidius' mode for murder also a craving for the throne?

michellem2009 said...

Kim: Everyone has a concience, and Claudius obviously is not exempt from that. Even though he was heartless enough to kill his brother doesn't mean that it doesn't haunt him still. Like in Macbeth, when Macbeth kills the king, his downfall is his guilt, even though he committed the act anyway. The same will be true for Claudius, guilting him into the truth somehow by the course of the play.

KendraS2009 said...

Adrienne: I know a little bit about Shakespeare's own experiences. Is there a particular event your referring to?

Lauren L said...

Hamlet is a sly fox. He is more intellegent then everyone knows. Hamlet knows who his friends are and what people to trust and what people to stay away from. He is in control of his emotions almost too much. Eventually Hamlet will get caught up in something more horrible then he thinks and will not be able to get himself out of the jam.

Kim C. 2010 said...

Taylor:
I think that Hamlets tragic flaw is deeper than that. I think Hamlet's flaw is really his indecision with his entire life. He doesnt know what is important (AKA his "To be or not to be that is the question" speech)

Lauren L said...

Is this about his father anymore? Hamlets anger seems to be about more then one thing now...

KaitlanW2009 said...

Addrienne: that and his "love" for his sister in law, I believe are the reasons for killing his brother. Maybe he's a little mad himself.

SaraB2009 said...

Taylor: That his hard to tell, whether or not Hamlet not being able to kill his ucle is his tragic flaw, because it is a sin to kill, so that would not be flaw like but the fact that his father wants Hamlet to avenge his death, and Hamlet not acting on it could be considered a flaw in his mind.

KCH2009 said...

yea lauren crushin on Hamlet, haha

IreneL2010 said...

Taylor: I think that is part of his tragic flaw. But he is too much of a coward to directly attack his uncle. I believe another piece of his flaw is that he is selfish. Both of these pieces, I believe, will ultimately lead to his downfall.

AdrienneB2009 said...

But isn't the aspect of someone standing up for his family, his king, a loved one, and what he believes to be right, a noble cause? Who do you support in this battle? (Hamlet vs. Claudius)

KatieO2010 said...

Does Hamlet just want the throne? Is that the real reason behind his actions?

SarahE2010 said...

Lauren: i agree that this whole conflict has strayed from Hamlet's father. It might have been the origin of the conflict but many other issues branched from that. Now Hamlet is battling with whether or not to avenge the murder, and he is angry because he was deprived of the throne.

mollyp2010 said...

response to the inner circle: Ive been wondering the same thing-did Hamlet actually see his father? and if he did, was it really his father and did he really ask Hamlet to avenge his death? I mean, this is going back to asking why would his father ask that?...

AdrienneB2009 said...

Is Hamlet just having fun playing with these peoples' emotions?

michellem2009 said...

Katie O: Hamlet wants revenge. Never does he say he wants to be king.

KaitlanW2009 said...

Adrienne: Hamlet. I believe Claudius is an immoral, manipulating, evil person.

IreneL2010 said...

Adrienne: I can't really say who's side I am on...both have their negative characteristics. Claudius killed an innocent man because he wanted a selfish gain. But Hamlet, on the other hand, is willing to kill Claudius to justify his uncle's wrong doing. And in turn he is showing his selfishness.

Are we seeing that the characters all suffer from relatively the same flaw?

SarahE2010 said...

Katie: I don't really think it is about the throne at all, i never picked up on that from the text. I think Hamlet was very close to his father; therefore i think this is about his final favor to his father. Like i think Hamlet almost sees it as his final way to pledge loyalty to his father.

mollyp2010 said...

adrienne: I dont think hes just having fun...he may be selfish but I dont think he is evil. I think that Hamlet still has a conscience

KCH2009 said...

michelle m: yea he wants revenge but who wouldnt want to be king? he wants power to rule his way

KendraS2009 said...

Adrienne: I do not support either Hamlet or Claudius. Claudius is a murderer and a throne stealer and Hamlet is selfish and only looks out for himself.
I also think that Hamlet is having his emotions played with more than he is playing with other people's emotions.

KatieM2009 said...

Inner Circle: I think that this started with avenging for his father but I feel that as the play continues on, the idea of murdering Claudius will cause many other issues and create more problems for Hamelt as he continues to struggle with his battle against him self and his religious believes.

Lauren L said...

I AM NOT CRUSHIN ON HAMLET!!!!

Kim C. 2010 said...

adrienne: as much as hamlet seems to be toying with everyone, I think that Hamlet feels he can't trust anyone anymore because they didnt care about his fathers death, and they are either pretending or they really dont care about his father anymore.

KendraS2009 said...

KCH: Hamlet may want to be king but its not first on his list of things he wants. Other than Claudius saying that Hamlet is next in line for the throne, it is not really mentioned. Never once does Hamlet say anything about it.

HaileyM2009 said...

Adrienne: I think there is a part of him that enjoys acting crazy so that he can confuse and mess with the people who have been hurting him. It shows when he pretends not to know Polonius (who he has known his whole life) and also when he comes into see Ophelia while she is sewing. Some of his actions may be a bit unnecessary but he enjoys it too much to not act like that.
The majority of his motivation is probably his goal to kill Claudius, but there is till that piece...

AdrienneB2009 said...

Is Hamlet's behavior a result of extreme loneliness? He is completely alone and feels he is the only one who is sane...who does he have to support him?

KatieO2010 said...

adrienne: Its hard to tell if he is just messing with people, based on his conversation with Polonious, I would say that massing with people certainly has its benefits. I think its about power, he is manipulating them and showing that he isn't going to take his Uncle's plans sitting down. He is proving, at least to himself, that he is a player in this game.

mollyp2010 said...

its ironic how Hamlet thinks hes the only one who is sane, while the rest of the world is convinced hes crazy.

AdrienneB2009 said...

Is Fortinbras th underdog?

michellem2009 said...

kch: True but I think that he isn't focused on that right now. If your father died by your uncle's hand, wouldn't you want to take down your uncle instead of taking over the family business? (poor analogy sorry :D) I think he is focused on revenge first, and if the throne comes along with it, great! I think that since Hamlet knows he will probably get the throne anyway, he is more focused on revenge.

Kim C. 2010 said...

I am wondering alot about, what Shakespeare ultimately wants to present through this play... What is the most vital message we have learned from the characters thus far?

KatieM2009 said...

Adrienne: I think that Hamlet feels incredibly portrayed by everyone around him. He cannot trust anyone in his family because he lost his dad and his mother married his uncle, he can't trust Ophelia because she is not supposed to see him and is split between her family and Hamlet. He has no one to look to for help and confidence. Hamlet cannot even look to his friends because they are betraying Hamlet as well by spying on Hamlet for Claudius and Gertrude. I think his madness has overwhelmed him from his different emotions of sadness and betrayl and just being generally upset about this whole situation that has become his life.

Lauren L said...

Drew is right how messed up is Claudius he couldnt even show emotion or feel guilty about killing his brother.

I believe only real tears are tears of innocence. Hamlets uncle will pay for what he did.

Fake tears and fake emotion is more cruel then the actual crime in a way.

KatieM2009 said...

Kim: Thus far I see that Shakespeare has showed through the plot that we should trust no one because each person is ultimately out to live for himself. This is shown with his uncle Claudius betraying the family and killing King Hamlet. No one in this play is doing something for anyone else, it is all for themselves and it is hard to trust a person that does not care for anyone but themselves.

KendraS2009 said...

I agree that Hamlet is just probably feeling really alone right now on top of all his other emotions. He has no one to turn to because he can't trust any of them.

KaitlanW2009 said...

Do you think the ghost could be a messenger? I think it was his father, because he seemed to feel great emotion when he saw him. And it wasn't necessarily fear.

IreneL2010 said...

Adrienne: I don't think we can consider Fortinbras the underdog because we do not know much about his strengths or his weaknesses. Though I do feel for his loss, I don't think it justifies his desire to kill...same goes for Hamlet.

Lauren L said...

Emotions usually get the best of us!!! The ghost in my opinion is real because Heratio and the guards found it. Though they are sad they are not as upset and connected to the king as Hamlet. Would they possibly help in the death of the new king???

SarahE2010 said...

Adrienne: I don't think his acts are of extreme loniless, but instead of extreme despiration. His father's death has devastated him and thrown his life off of balance. I think all of his crazy acts are him trying to balance his life back out.

KatieO2010 said...

Is Queen Gertrude a good mother?

KendraS2009 said...

Sarah E: Although you make a good point, I don't think that Hamlet's crazy acts are going to balance his life back out. Being crazy seems as though it will only make his life more hectic.

KatieM2009 said...

Lauren: I think that if Hamlet recruits anyone else to assist him with the death of Claudius it would just continue this train of pain and suffering. I believe that if Claudius will be killed it will be just by Hamlet to put an end to the train of betrayl and murder because if that train is not ended, I feel it would be hard to put an end to the play as well.

Anna P2009 said...

Hamlet's actions aren't a cry for help they are just a cover really. He's trying to cover his tracks and make sure that no one finds out what he is doing because he can't trust anyone and if anyone did find out the consequences could be dire.

michellem2009 said...

Katie O: If your father was killed and within a month your mother remarried... would YOU see her as a good mother??

I say no.

Wil... said...

Is Hamlet's mind transparent or opaque?

Lauren L said...

Isolation is good for Hamlet so people will leave him alone and he can plan his thoughts out and decide what to do.

Lauren L said...

100

mollyp2010 said...

Hamlet needs a friend

KaitlanW2009 said...

Katie: I don't think the queen is a good mother at all. What kind of mother lets her children's father be killed. She obviously didn't care enough about Hmalet to worry about his feelings, and she obviously doesn't right now. Her son is feeling lonely, and betrayed and she goes on frolicking with her new husband.

michellem2009 said...

To elaborate a little, Gertrude isn't paying any attention to Hamlet, and dissmisses his madness to her hasty marriage and the death of the King, and only that. I think she is too selfish (like everyone else is) to care about the actions of her seemingly crazy son.

KatieO2010 said...

michelle: I wouldn't see her as a good mother, but that doesn't mean she's not trying. We don't know exactly why she married Claudius, she might have been trying to hold the family together. She seems to care for her son, she seems to be trying.

KendraS2009 said...

Lauren and Katie: I do not think that Hamlet would want to include anyone else in his plan. He cannot really trust anyone right now. Also, the more people he lets in on his secret, the more likely it is that the secret will get out and everyone will know.

IreneL2010 said...

I agree Molly...haha.

Katie: I don't think the queen is a good mother what so ever. She might have good intentions, but we don't ever see them come out. She doesn't want something undesirable to ruin the glow of her new marriage. She too is selfish.

KatieO2010 said...

Are there any good parents in the play?

michellem2009 said...

Katie: She isn't trying though... all she cares about is her new, incestuous marriage, and that is partially why Hamlet is so frustrated. Since Gertrude has moved on, she doesn't want to be brought down by her "too much changed son".

KatieM2009 said...

Katie O: What is an example of Gertrude showing passion for her hurting son from the text?

Anna P2009 said...

Katie: Queen Gertrude married Cladius so quickly and it was probably so that she could stay powerful. She doesn't fight the fact that the throne is rightfully Hamlet's because if Hamlet became king she would be obsolete. She is threatened by her sons power so she joins in with Claudius and together they are being horrible parents to Hamlet

HaileyM2009 said...

I think Gertrude, and whether or not she is a good mother, is irrelevant to most of the plot.
Shakespeare seems to think that women are insignificant, emphasizing on their weakness ("frailty thy name is women...")
Also, Hamlet's father tells Hamlet to leave Gertrude alone, saying that fate will take care of her.
She seems pretty insignificant...

mollyp2010 said...

too much changed son...if anyone can see whats up with a person, one could argue that it would be their mother. His mom sees that he isnt himself and that he is deeply unhappy. I think she knows that she probably contributed to this unhappyness.